Comments: pcarr -

FoundationsOfFaith1a @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:1 - Let us ask then of what report Isaiah refers to when he says "our report". There is a definite tie to prophecy here as Isaiah is a prophet first and foremost. The most straight forward answer as to whether we believe prophecy or not is "no". Prophecy has meant little or nothing in the past/present to the vast majority of us. Even amongst those who do follow prophecy there is a tendency to self interpret it into something that better fits our whim. But, hidden in the context of the question, prophecy is underscored by the lengthy report of the Mosaic Law which we assumed all along was sufficient and that we were faithfully maintaining, but yet, the prophets were constantly testifying by that we weren't coming even close. Add to that the report of history, that over and over the same cycle played out of momentary revival to the things of God but, sudden and long term falling against those things, infatuation with things other than even to idolatry despite the Law and despite the Abrahamic Covenant despite acquisition of the promised land and supernatural victory over many a foe. Add to that the history of God speaking to man, that in almost every case God spoke in advance of what was going to happen and almost exclusively through men that had long been established as being inerrant in regards to prophetical matters great and small. The testament, the report then is not only of what Christ is to be but, what nature with which we opposed Him with and of how it has been established that there is no other way given under heaven.

FoundationsOfFaith1a @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:1 - The amazing part of the Messianic prophecy is that no one man or women had the entire message, they were each given pieces. God has used these individual pieces combined together to reveal just how mighty His arm/hand really is. This could not have been manufactured by man nor brought about to this detail. Such revelation strikes fear into the heart of believer and non-believer alike and makes us all to shy away and deflect each in our own way.

FoundationsOfFaith1b @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:2 DRY GROUND - When Isaiah's Christ finally appears 700+ years later, He appears amidst a several hundred year drought of divine communication. This predicted silence tells us more about this period of time than any words. For all the good and strong religious things Israel had going for it, minus prophecy what they did have clearly was not enough to keep the true spiritual landscape from ceasing up. Consider, they remained highly devout and trusting to the Abrahamic covenant and their blood line. Consider also, they were deeply zealous of moral law and commandment. They were bound and determined to regain possession of their promised land. They were deeply proud of their national history and religious tradition. Yet, for all of this it added up only to dry ground. We like they allow ourselves every intellectual consent to all things just and spiritual up to but excluding prophecy. Where does that get us? History testifies against these well intentioned Hebrews as the events surrounding Jesus unfolded for they did not know our Lord when He stood with them face to face as prophiceied in much detail. We must consider well God's hand as it comes to prophecy, the drought that continues for them, the drought that will end in the end times when the vail is lifted, when their believing son's and daughters again will prophecy.

FoundationsOfFaith1b @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:2 FORM - Minus a divinely established prophetical framework of Messiah, Messiah has no form, He is whatever or whenever or whoever any of a billion different people want Him to be (or not). Not the way of a God who has written His undeniable code into everything else universal. Here it is not that Messiah does not have form, it is that we don't accept the form that He is in because we don't accept the prophecy concerning Him. The report we purposely reject is a detailed account of who He is, what He has to do, why He has to do it, why there is no other way. If the report is fulfilled down to the smallest detail and confirmed from on high and we still do not accept it, then that is no longer a problem with the acceptability of the report it is rather a outing of a rejecting heart.

FoundationsOfFaith1c @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:3 Estimation - Myself coming from a medical background, I know first hand how easy and how often it is that the patient rejects and denies the Doctor's report. Eyes glaze over and the ears hear only what they want to hear. Worse of all, the blame is transfered from evidence to the examiner, from the problem to the cure, from medical reasoning to pie in the sky positive and dismissive imagination. The revealer of spiritual truth likewise becomes the despised and rejected, He is the gloomy boone, the stick in the mud, the one only acquainted with grief and sorrow. Perhaps however it is the grief of knowing the cause and the condition and the means to a beneficial outcome but, see's in the patient's future a week of half hearted diet and exercise and three months further to a final heart attack (of which the doctor will be blamed).

FoundationsOfFaith1c @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:3 Estimation - Human alliance and allegiance are largely based upon the perception of concerted power and it's ability to enforce strategic will. Minus prophecy we are left to seeing Jesus as the victim; perhaps the ultimate victim... nothing more. The victory that the prophets intended for us to see is lost in the formless and nebulous wish wash dissonant imagination. Jesus did/does in fact exert emense concerted power and enforces strategic (over sin/death/creation/eternity etc..), but, not in the manner that immediately serves our rebellious self will best.

FoundationsOfFaith1d @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:4 SURELY - Despite the exhortation "to live life with no regrets" very few of us ever do. And the ones that do, may do it more out of callousness and spite. Many fall to the opposite extreme of overwhelming sorrow and grief and many rest uncomfortably somewhere in the middle. Should I however re-read this verse and add my sorrows to the sorrows that I have caused others, lay the sorrows yours and mine upon the next person and the next until all the sorrows of all the souls that have lived here on this earth; you can see that there is quite a bit of sorrows for the Lord to bare. Shall we add up then our griefs? Shall we add to our perceptions of this weight to the reality of it? Some people do not care whether Jesus carries their personal sorrows and griefs; it does not move them, to heck with the weight of others. Many do care and are thankful, but, their esteem for Him sadly goes no further than Him being stricken/smitten/afflicted.

FoundationsOfFaith1d @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:4 SURELY - What becomes even more amazing is that this is predicted long before it happened, how we were going to see and react to Messiah, and we still reacted and still react today in this manner. This is a sign of the prophecy being exactly right.

FoundationsOfFaith1e @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:5 BUT HE WAS - Israel's historic rejections of prophecy like ours today is centered upon the concept of what is "right in our own eyes". If the prophet says that things are not right, if the law says things are not right, if history says things are not right, if captivity and bondage and poverty says things are not right, if lifeless static religion and devotion says that things are not right, then all these things must be wrong and falsely accusing because we ourselves feel ourselves as doing these things right. When all these things suggest transgression and iniquity and suggest it being so for ages regardless of our actions our intentions it is best that we listen. When the Son of God becomes wounded/bruised/chastised/scurged for our actions and conditions we need to take notice regardless of what we theorize transgression and iniquity to be. The fact is that these things are serious enough that (no matter what we believe these things to be) God took a very specific action on our behalf.

FoundationsOfFaith1f @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:6 GONE ASTRAY - Using Israel as our example, where did we all go astray? Morality/Civility? Devotion/Zealousness? Belief/Determination/Hope? Perseverance/Endurance/Suffering? Tradition/Heritage? No. Prophecy! All of these other worthy elements only go to show our desperate need for this iniquity to be lifted from us, the utter vanity of human effort in doing so. Via prophecy we understand that iniquity isn't just lifted, it has to go somewhere and not just anybody can lift it nor take it upon themselves. More importantly, iniquity is not just stolen away from us by Jesus, it must be acknowledged, turned from and willingly surrendered to Him. Via these other elements we are subjected by God to this vanity with a hope that we would come to this one conclusion: the need for Christ complete. Should we go our own way on this central point we will have gone astray. This is where we all have gone astray and continue.

FoundationsOfFaith1g @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:7 - The plan is obvious, let the prophets do the speaking, let Messiah do the doing, and in the fulfillment of these things in this precise even miraculous way the arm of the Lord is revealed throughout. The spiritual truth Jesus wants us to face up to is best revealed to us by our observing what He was willing to endure from God the Father silently without complaint or argument or legal maneuver as our substitute. What is it then that His silence says? Divine Love. Not just sacrificial but, redeeming. Not just righteous but, much needed. Not nebulous and warm and fuzzy and whatever we want it to be but, structured and predicted and specific and proven. It is a love to be surrendered to and enveloped within. What we know of Divine Love minus this prophetical structure is little more than the very rejection that nails Him to the cross, keeps Him off at a shadowy intellectual distance. What He knows of the Triune Love Divine expects much more than the vanity of our death and condemnation, its is the hope of a resurrection into a new and glorious light. His light. Mercy and Truth are met together. What words could be formed to precisely convey this? None.

FoundationsOfFaith1h @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:8 - There can be no doubt that this chapter prophecies about the Messiah, that this verse in particular prophecies His death. How Hebrew scholars come to two Messiahs (Lamb and King) at one time instead of one Messiah at two times (Sacrificial Lamb then because of that returning Triumphant King) is beyond scriptural interpretation. The death of Messiah is all important to His being rightful King. Just as His resurrection in kjv@Isaiah:53:10-12 .

FoundationsOfFaith1h @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:8 - By the time of this verses' fulfillment there should be two very familiar Jewish phrases borrowed from Hebrew prophets (major and minor) "transgression" and "my people". After all the times the prophets have mentioned this in the many national prophecies that have already come true, after all the times the nation has finally repented from these and been restored, Isaiah's use here and now should touch a central nerve. It should but, it doesn't. What is it that people then and people today most dislike about prophecy? The constant reminder of transgression and the misunderstanding of what is meant by the title "my people". Non Hebrews the world over have difficulty with the Jews as a whole either because they see contradiction in that the 'respecter of no man' has favor on a 'peculiar people' or because a specific Jewish transgression killed everyone else’s Savior or because an ancestor of theirs was tricked out of their birth right. Set those preconceptions aside for the moment and realize that all we have gone astray like sheep, that He has set apart certain sheep as an example (pursuing all that religion offers minus prophecy therefore over stepping the set line) that we might see our need and our transgression by theirs. He deals with them in double measure so that He doesn't have to deal with the rest of us in the same tone. Will there be reward for Israel having undergone this? Yes indeed but, not until the new beginning. Non believers today are fooled into looking for immediate perfection in the "chosen (nation or church)" where it should be seen transgressors clinging to Messiah for deliverance.

FoundationsOfFaith1i @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:9 - Death is the consequence of sin. How is it that Christ died if He did not sin? Our sin is transfered on to Him. How it is that the Jews missed this is a mystery as they had been practicing substitutionary sacrifice since the time of Cain and Abel. Abraham had been stopped short of sacrificing his son by God having been told that the God Himself would provide His own sacrifice when the time came. The problem the scholars had with this particular sacrifice is that Jesus claims to be tri-equal in the Godhead; God would not reduce Himself to becoming flesh and therefore would not be in a position to die... eternal is always eternal in their logic. Let's go back to the sacrifice however... what innocent sacrifice would be left God the Father to transfer our sin's to if not either His Holy Spirit or His Holy Son whom all things were created through and for? Can an eternal Angel be made flesh? Can an Angel then be the substitution? Following this logic, the Jews are left without a final sacrifice. They are also left without something vitally important to the rest of their religious endeavors as well: the prophetic structure of a Messiah. Thus, despite everything that the scriptures tell us about Messiah and all that the of the arm of the Lord has since revealed, Jesus being Messiah to them is blaspheme. The same contradictory logic plagues a great many tutored intellects still today.

FoundationsOfFaith1j @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:10 THE PLEASURE OF THE LORD - There is something much more to Jehovah's pleasure than finally seeing someone suffer for sin or being able to punish someone for all this wrong doing, get all this anger off His chest. There is that for the moment only prophetic eyes can see resulting from this sacrifice that ties everything that we have been through to everything that He intended for us; something that in the end He would be willing to reinstate eternal life and communion with. It is not us just being better people. It is not Israel just being a stronger Israel. It is not about the martyrs and the prophets being able to say "see I told you so". It is not about getting rid of all the bad apples that distract us. This is about Divinity and Holiness and hope fulfilled and stunning mercy and righteousness and true and honest heart felt worship and a deliverance from all this corruption into the rightful Kingdom of our true King Jesus. This is about things that have yet to even entered our minds. God is most pleased now for this sacrificial stage having been fulfilled now in Jesus? Yes I should say! But are we?

FoundationsOfFaith1k @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:11 BY HIS KNOWLEDGE - The knowledge of Him is afforded to us by the report of the prophets first and foremost and then by the testimony of those present with Him and then by the testimony of the Law/the History/the general scriptures. These are all works of the Holy Spirit. Had there not been the report there would be no way for us to know anything else than we could imagine. We would not know why to look for Him. We would not know when to look for Him. We would not know where to look for Him. We would not know what He would be like, what His message would be, what He would have to do, why He would have to do it in a very specific way. We would not know what the result of Him doing this would mean to us, how bad our situation really was, how much the truth would actually be despised and rejected, how secular and religious history would depict Him. Having this knowledge of Him now we can begin to see how His further knowledge of the Father is working to justify many. Light poured into darkness.

FoundationsOfFaith1k @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:11 TRAVAIL/SATISFIED - Death is one thing, the travail added upon Jesus' soul in death is unimaginable. The prophetical and eye witness accounts of what Christ suffered are overwhelming. Even these accounts however have little power to convict the wayward heart if not convinced of how the suffering fits into the larger structure of Messianic prophecy. Justifying and bearing each individual's iniquity is of little transformitive consequence until one is convinced further that the Arm of the Lord has been revealed in it and that the power and force of God almighty has confirmed it to be so. How then is that confirmed? Continue on then to the power of Christ's Ressurection.

FoundationsOfFaith1l @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:12 HE SHALL DIVIDE - How can the dead Christ divide anything with anyone when He is dead? It is in the resurrection of Christ that the confirmation of the prophets' report is most powerfully revealed. Jesus was a man of miracles certainly but, Jesus could not have performed this miracle on Himself. This would be the hand of God alone. Not resurrected like Lazarus restored back to this life only to die again, instead resurrected as the first born from the entirety of death into His glorified eternal state, witnessed of physically and then witnessed ascending to the right hand throne of God. Sin, iniquity, transgression, death, all defeated and lifted. His resurrection is the guarantee of our future resurrection and the division of His spoils to His eternal flock. It is the arm of the Lord revealed. It is also our guarantee of His intercession in the meantime till that glorious day comes. It is all to the praise of the heavenly Father who designed and intended and by grace made to happen in exact and righteous fashion.

FoundationsOfFaith1l @ @ RandyP comments: kjv@Isaiah:53:12 - The word "great" used here might better refer to "the many". It may at the same time refer to those who have been made strong in their own resurrection through His. God the Father will give a large portion of all dominion to Jesus, in turn Jesus will divide the spoils of that with a great many. The plan was never toward letting us become whatsoever/whosoever we wanted to be thus fulfilling our deceitful desires, it was for Jesus to be our eternal Lord and for us to be partakers/receipients of His divine nature, the children of the living God, spiritual creatures of tremendous significance.